Merlin Entertainments General Discussion

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Jack
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Saying that BPB is higher quality than Merlin is like saying that Drayton Manor surpasses Europa Park in quality. It makes no sense at all.

The company have done an amazing job since taking over the shambles that was Tussauds from 2002-2007. As a quick refresher of what Merlin have bought about:

Saw The Ride
Th13teen
Ghost Train
Smiler
Gruffalo
Oblivion The Black Hole
Raptor
The Swarm
Mutiny Bay
Flug Der Dämonen
Krake

And that's ignoring a lot more, try comparing that to the investment made to BPB over the last 20 years. But when you consider the quality of a lot of those attractions is when you realise Merlin are actually doing a very good job. Rides like Ghost Train which to many isn't a great ride is possibly one of the most complex ride systems on the planet, the theming is also very impressive in places when looking at rides like Oblivion the Black Hole, The Swarm and even Th13teen. That goes without saying about the fact SW8 seems to be incredibly heavily themed and although the rides layout looks bland to me, the theming I find very exciting.

Once again, I'm baffled as to how any other UK theme park compares to Merlin, let alone Gardaland and Heide Park. The parks are well kept for the most part, rides are maintained very nicely and although there have been some closures there hasn't been anything of major significance removed as far as I'm concerned.

Merlin are definitely not perfect, they are very far from it, but to claim that Blackpool Pleasure Beach of all parks beats anything Merlin has is just gibberish to me when you bring in statistics, investments and general figures, that theme park does not even come close to anything Merlin has. :)
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Capt.Barnacles
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Nothing more I can add to this point but agree with Owen, that Icon is the one and only reason I'm returning to BPB next year for the first time in well over 10 years. My last visit was before Infusion was built and they've done nothing to entice me to go anytime soon, but Icon will change that.
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MakoMania
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I can see that Merlin have lots of fans here, so I appreciate that I'm not going to get anywhere.

BPB is the leading UK park IMO, Merlin have slowly destroyed the magic that Alton Towers had. Days at BPB for me are much more enjoyable than days at Towers, and at the end of the day, that's why I prefer BPB, not to mention that their recent investments are superior to those of AT.

Just my opinion, it can easily be argued that AT is the leading park as well.
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Jack
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MakoMania wrote:I can see that Merlin have lots of fans here, so I appreciate that I'm not going to get anywhere.

BPB is the leading UK park IMO, Merlin have slowly destroyed the magic that Alton Towers had. Days at BPB for me are much more enjoyable than days at Towers, and at the end of the day, that's why I prefer BPB, not to mention that their recent investments are superior to those of AT.

Just my opinion, it can easily be argued that AT is the leading park as well.
There's a difference between saying "BPB is my favourite UK theme park" and "BPB is the leading UK theme park" remember, the latter is provably false, but you're entitled to a favourite obviously. I don't care what other people enjoy, but to claim that Merlin is just downright terrible at this point is a very naive claim.
I've said it before, the people that put Alton Towers in the place it is today is the Tussauds owners from 2002-2007 before Merlin took over. The rise in quality since then seems undeniable to me :)
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MakoMania
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Jack wrote:
MakoMania wrote:I can see that Merlin have lots of fans here, so I appreciate that I'm not going to get anywhere.

BPB is the leading UK park IMO, Merlin have slowly destroyed the magic that Alton Towers had. Days at BPB for me are much more enjoyable than days at Towers, and at the end of the day, that's why I prefer BPB, not to mention that their recent investments are superior to those of AT.

Just my opinion, it can easily be argued that AT is the leading park as well.
There's a difference between saying "BPB is my favourite UK theme park" and "BPB is the leading UK theme park" remember, the latter is provably false, but you're entitled to a favourite obviously. I don't care what other people enjoy, but to claim that Merlin is just downright terrible at this point is a very naive claim.
I've said it before, the people that put Alton Towers in the place it is today is the Tussauds owners from 2002-2007 before Merlin took over. The rise in quality since then seems undeniable to me :)
Oh I agree absolutely, Merlin are much better than the 2002-2007 lot, and I have said that I like some of what they do, but I also hate a lot of it which I think really degrades the parks.
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S.J_O'Grady
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Merlin are capable of doing some fantastic things. Yes they can fail, Sub Terra for example, but they can also succeed, with the likes of Ghost Train. Their obsession with accommodation is something I'm not a fan of, and I hate to see prices go up while ride offerings go down. But I honestly don't believe any company the size of Merlin is even close to perfect. My main problem with Alton at the moment is CCL. It won't be sorted next year, but if they can use 2019 to fix it up and not throw money at CBeebies then I'll be satisfied. Merlin could be worse!
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Owen
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I’d keep my eye on CCL during 2019/2020! :P
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Burniel
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Well this blew up :lol

Where to start ... firstly I do not want us to find ourselves in a situation where Blackpool Pleasure Beach is the best we have, and I will never say that Merlin produce more bad quality attractions than good, because that's simply not the case. But it's all too easy to point to some of Merlin's more recent successful investments at parks and (rightfully) praise them on such achievements without actually covering the negatives of Merlin Entertainments' operations of their Resort Theme Parks

The issue here is conflating the quality of new attractions with the quality of the parks. Perhaps, as enthusiasts who visit Merlin parks regularly, we tend to be more forgiving and become used to seeing certain aspects of certain parks in poorer condition than they ought to be. Simple upkeep is an area where I genuinely think Merlin struggle for such a commended chain of parks, and perhaps its not surprising, given that they're an huge global company with far more profitable things to do than care for the finer details of their parks in the way that a smaller park might. In order to defend myself against the inevitable tirade of outrage, I will of course say that Merlin don't completely neglect their parks in this sense; the Towers Loving Care scheme is an excellent example of Merlin trying to show the pride they have for their parks, even if it consists mainly of what should really be annual maintenance for the world's second largest attractions company. But that does not forgive some catastrophic failures on Merlin's part that could/can be avoided simply by taking more care for the attractions which might not be at the front of the marketing campaign, but provide a fuller, deeper, higher quality overall park:

Why are flat rides dropping like flies and being replaced by cheap and tacky games? Why are attractions such as Colossos and Loggers Leap SBNO as a result of a lacking in proper maintenace? Why has Old Town been invaded by ridiculously out of place travelling fair rides? Why is a nearly-new multi-million pound dark ride sitting abandoned in Forbidden Valley? Why have more accommodation options been built in the UK in the last five years than large-scale ride investments? Why are opening hours being cut on days where rides are frequently seeing full queues at 5pm? Why is scenery on some iconic attractions disappearing without replacement? Why are otherwise well-themed areas being ruined by installations of things like Nitrogenie in wholly inappropriate locations?

But I digress. I don't want to simply point out what I believe to be Merlin's flaws. It would be incredibly unjustified for me to sit towards the end of another season of several thoroughly enjoyable days at Merlin parks and simply speak ill of the company which, on the whole, provide a fantastic service on a day-to-day basis. Merlin are the best we have (for now) by quite a way, and I'm not trying to argue that. My point is simply that, with Merlin set to press on with "the winners" without fixing some of their prior mistakes, it's not impossible for their customer base to decide that, while Merlin are the most innovative in this country, they might (personally) have a nicer day out at a rapidly-improving smaller park, where the owners demonstrate pride in every corner of their park, and it is not simply (in the words of some of my family who visited Thorpe Park a few weeks ago on a trip to the UK after moving to Australia in the late 00s) "a contest of who has the most money". Is it not possible that the country's medium-sized parks will soon start to become competition as a result of people leaving the stress-filled closure minefield that we've seen of late and opting instead to visit somewhere cheaper, more cared about and more personal?

That's my point. Not that Merlin are bad or don't care. Not that Blackpool, or any other park, is necessarily better. Simply that Merlin are not - as some seem to be suggesting - untouchable in their position as the operator of the UK's four leading theme parks, especially in light of recent events. :)
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jackf1tz
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God, we're actually having an argument about which park in the UK is best! AT has always been my favourite, but I'm sick of only having 2 or 3 legitimate options! If we could actually have some decent opposition, like we're finally getting with the likes of Paultons and hopefully Blackpool, then Merlin will get off their backsides and invest in some flat rides, a bin, some more benches, and a pressure washer for the Smiler. If only Drayton Manor could open a new rollercoaster...
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abigsmurf
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Gotta join in with Burniel on a mini-rant. Why must new rides come at the expense of other rides, and rides with wide appeal at that? No log ride, no indoor boat ride, Hex was closed for an entire season with the excuse of it getting a refurb (which turned out to be a lie, the refurb didn't need a season closure). I did the rapids, the waterfall was turned off, all the squirters were turned off; I get they don't want people getting too cold but it was a pretty turgid ride were you barely get splashed with all those elements off. 

There's also weirdness continuing with SW8 of them closing family rides and opening awkward 'too intense for everyone to ride but not intense enough for enthusiasts'. New rides should always make the park better for as many people as possible and I'm not so sure that's happening with Alton Towers. It's frustrating to see big focuses on new hotels, new rides for 6 year olds whilst you visit Alton towers with a mixed group and find some people have depressingly little to go on.

Final point of annoyance is that you go offpeak, rides open 10-10:30, and you're presented with signs saying queues close at 4pm which really isn't on. Half the food outlets are closed and you're constantly walking past closed drinks/ice cream stalls. It's a bit of a downer on the atmosphere. Tear down the semi-permanent ice cream shacks, replace them with portable units that can be wheeled in on peak days left in storage on days they aren't needed. 

Merlin seem to be in a bit of a weird place at the moment, chasing too hard on the under 12s (not just Alton Towers but their general strategy it seems) and cheaping out too much in the general running of the parks. AT's visitor numbers seem to be sliding (beyond the Smiler effect), this could easily turn into a spiral.
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TowersTimes News have reported about Merlin being relegated from the FTSE 100 index. More details in the article
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Sadly this relegation doesn't surprise me. Whilst I'm definitely no expert on the stock exchange and the value of companies, it seems Merlin are just making poor decisions at the moment when it comes to their overall strategy for growing the company.

Yes, accommodation can offer a large return on investment, however in order to fill the additional rooms you also need to invest in capex projects in the parks themselves.to attract people to stay in the new accommodation. Merlin are very much in danger of entering a vicious circle of ever deepening cuts which will unfortunately ultimately prove to be their downfall.

I think 2018 is going to be a key year for Merlin, especially with SW8 opening at Towers. It's going to be interesting to see where things go from here.
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Robert.W
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After trying to find some of the logic in Merlin's current strategy, I'm thinking perhaps they are going along with a "short term loss, long term gain" type method. Perhaps their recent obsession for accommodation was just about preparing their attractions for the future when they might perhaps start focusing more on the actual attractions... just a though though.
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Robert, I really hope this is their strategy too. Surely they cannot be adding more hotels without keeping the Theme Parks in proportion to them?
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Zach
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Reading these last few pages, some experts who have watched merlin take over tussuards, some who have recently come into the theme park enthusiast sector, however all seem to be able to see the obvious flaw in Merlins play to invest in hotels and not capex projects is worrying. If it is that obvious to us, ultimately the customers that people aren’t interested in over priced hotels (who did very little to provide entertainment for the adults who actually pay for the privalledge to stay) how is it not obvious to Merlin executives and Nick himself. 

The first rule of business always has and always will be “you have to spend money to make money” but spending it on hotels will to make money if there is no reason, as has been said previously, to stay in the hotels or visit attractions. 
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Liam.W
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I have just stumbled across this (new?) website for Merlin Magic Making! It has a rather interesting video about what MMM do!

http://magic.lmcpreview.co.uk/
Ride count since the beginning of 2015: 2632!
Ride count 2021: 416!
Cred count: 167!

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lewis97
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Liam.W wrote:I have just stumbled across this (new?) website for Merlin Magic Making! It has a rather interesting video about what MMM do!

http://magic.lmcpreview.co.uk/
That website's been around a while I believe :)
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Justin
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Yes, it has been around for a while but it isn't one that is generally accessed by many. It is certainly worth a look.
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You may be interested to know that you can now put your wildest ideas to MMM as they have a 'bonkers box' on their website (a slightly bonkers name too but hey)
This is where you can let your imagination run wild! Got a crazy idea for a new ride? Or a concept for a new theme park, or maybe it’s just a new way of flushing the loo!? It could be anything and the wackier the better! Sketch or write your ideas here in the Bonkers Box and hit send and the creative boffins of Merlin Magic Making will consider your idea and maybe even make it a reality!
This is quite a neat idea with the world moving to DIY input/ user-involved experiences with lots of things from gaming to music. So if you want Alton or any Merlin parks to add a thing that exists only in your head you can now plant the idea in their heads too! Although they should really read all these forums too- some good ideas on here (and some not so good)! And I guess if you want a much loved ride to stay or even return you could suggest that here too with your ideas for keeping or making it fresh! Queue loads of people dreaming of being the next John Wardley, well you never know! With a little imagination and a good grounding of realism.....

http://magic.lmcpreview.co.uk/

Edited: clarification
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lewis97
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Merlin's share price has now reached its lowest level in the 4(ish) years since the company went public...

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It will be interesting to see what is said at their 2017 Preliminary Results presentation at the start of March, depending on what happens during the next month.
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