Attraction Source Forum

I think the 30mil figure included extensive R&D.

Why are we comparing a dark ride with a coaster?

The most part of Ghost Train's budget would have went into the ride system as well as headsets and PC with would have came to at least £1200 per set - so it's not really a super accurate comparison in regards to how much they will spend on the theming.

People need to learn that the cost doesn't necessarily reflect the quality of the theming, and so really it's a tricky one to work out!

Went into Derby city centre this morning to try and get some freebies with towers tastic, the lady hiding them worked in marketing at the towers. I tried to spark a conversation about sw8 but she was having none of it haha! Oh well, worth a try!

I'm getting excited, surely construction must be started within coming months!

towerslover wrote:I'm getting excited, surely construction must be started within coming months!

The application indicates that construction will start in September, if approved.

lewis97 wrote:

towerslover wrote:I'm getting excited, surely construction must be started within coming months!

The application indicates that construction will start in September, if approved.

Then the fun of taking pictures over the fence begins :lol

Themeing wise, remember this is the same company that built the new London Dungeon. They have the skills within the organisation and can do outstanding themeing when they want to. If the new attraction is based on Pirates or a Mine then they should get good value for money themeing wise as it's not going to require LED screens or projection mapping etc.

Why is everyone so obsessed about Theming these days? Oblivion anyone? A well designed ride does not rely upon theming to make it great, but a poorly designed one does.

It's to do with the difference between Theme Park and Amusement Park. Also Oblivion has theming, and it would be nowhere near as good without it. It would rank as one of the worst dive machines, but is one of the best. Same goes for Baron. Sure a ride that hasn't got theming can be great, but theming can improve it to be up there with the best.

I think it's to do with personality. A ride without it's own personality is just not as interesting or memorable and theming elements help get that across.

Javs wrote:Why is everyone so obsessed about Theming these days? Oblivion anyone? A well designed ride does not rely upon theming to make it great, but a poorly designed one does.

Having a great ride but poor theming is like putting a Ferrari engine inside a Skoda.

A good ride is one that is enjoyable at the time and one that is memorable in the future. Theming is just one of many elements that contribute to these.

Javs wrote:Oblivion anyone? A well designed ride does not rely upon theming to make it great, but a poorly designed one does.

Yeah, I mean it's not like Oblivion had an entire area themed to it and rides redeveloped to fit with it or anything.

In all seriousness to address your point, it just makes the attraction more immersive, and in turn gains a much better response from the audience. Stealth is often regarded better than Kingda Ka due to its (minimal) theming and launch - yet it's half the height. On the other hand, the Seven Dwarfs Mine Train isn't really liked all that much even though it's heavily themed and this is due to the coaster layout being boardering on mediocre. It when a good layout, good theming, good marketing and good atmosphere all come together to create a great ride.

A lot more goes into rides than just a good layout or good theming - I feel people need to start remembering this more often

Well that is kind of my point. You can have the best themeing in the world, but if it is a dull ride then it is going to be rather boring. Oblivion does not really have a lot of themeing, but is incredibly well designed so it really packs a punch both physically and psychologically.

Don't get me wrong, I love some good themeing and understand the effect it has, but I would rather have a well designed rollercoaster over and above it, especially when on a tight budget.

To be honest, this psychologically rubbish is getting very very boring and Merlin use it far too much. Just some of their examples that spring to mind:
- Thirteen (marketing mainly)
- Oblivion
- The Smiler
- Derren Brown's Ghost Train

Now take into account other theme parks and none of them use this. They just create a great ride with great theming and you have a brilliant ride.

Just look at Nemesis if you want a local example, a great layout that hugs the terrain, and some fairly decent theming and you've got one of the most favourite inverted rides around.

What Alton excel at is packing a great layout into a small space, but where they severely fall down is the theming or where they get more space than they know what to do with (Thirteen)

If anyone remembers Katanga Canyon back before they stuck in the pop up stalls and cheap signage, you'll know exactly what they're capable of. In my opinion KC and the Gloomy Woods were some of the best themed areas of the park.

Also, this isn't just about the rides theming, it's about the area it sits in too which is again why KC and GW are amongst the favourite as the rides intertwine with the area providing interaction. Even though it's a small area, it's well designed so doesn't feel like that.
Oh and before anyone mentions DF, this is a terrible terrible example of how to lay an area out. It's a mess and feels like it was thrown together on the back of a fag packet.


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In all fairness Oblivion wasn't a Merlin attraction. Most attractions play with psychology, however Merlin have been making this more explicit as of late. I personally like what they've done - but now it's time to rein in using psychology as a marketing ploy I think!

Justin wrote:

lewis97 wrote:

towerslover wrote:I'm getting excited, surely construction must be started within coming months!

The application indicates that construction will start in September, if approved.

Then the fun of taking pictures over the fence begins :lol

And using the sky ride for pictures.

I'm not sure about the theming argument. Theming should enhance rollercoasters not be the highlight of a ride. If you don't have trust in merlin think about how much worse it is in America with Cedar Fair and Six Flags.

owenrita121 wrote:DBGT definitely did not cost 40 million, so I'm unsure where you got that from... The most I've heard it come to was 30 million but even then I find that hard to believe...

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This is the cost. It was mentioned during my lift hill climb at Thorpe.

Javs wrote:Why is everyone so obsessed about Theming these days? Oblivion anyone? A well designed ride does not rely upon theming to make it great, but a poorly designed one does.

It might be worth reading an article which the Independent published a couple of weeks ago. It talks about all the different elements which make up a ride. Here is just a small extract...

Kashmira Gander - Independent wrote:In the search for superlative rides, the teams behind roller coasters must piece together a narrative, be it a space adventure or a high-paced chase in the jungle, that works with any innovations – the tallest ride, the most twists, the steepest drops, to create a seamless experience. “It’s not just about the coasters themselves now,” says Jeff Hornick, the senior director of theme park development at SeaWorld Parks and Entertainment, which oversees BuschGardens and Adventure Island in the US.

Most recently, he worked on the Mako at SeaWorld Orlando. On this “hypercoaster”, based on one of the ocean’s fastest sharks, riders experience many moments of weightlessness, and reach speeds of up to 73mph from a top height of 200ft. But, he says, “the queue lines, shops and restaurants that surround each ride are themed and meticulously designed in a certain way to give an all-round, immersive experience for guests. Every part plays an element, from the sounds you hear to the lighting effects”.

Source: http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style ... 44971.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

nemefan08 wrote:I'm not sure about the theming argument. Theming should enhance rollercoasters not be the highlight of a ride. If you don't have trust in merlin think about how much worse it is in America with Cedar Fair and Six Flags.

Agreed. Also the discussion here is revolving around both extremes, according to this thread people are worried that we'll get either:
- dull ride with great theming
- great ride with dull theming

Truth is there is a large window of possibilities between these two options, and I don't see why Alton will necessarily fall into either extremes. And that's all forgetting the fact that great ride with great theming also is a possibility!



I know a lot of people are concerned with the plan and scale of the layout, but a lot can be done on a short layout. They opened a 1446.8ft (440m) wooden at Walibi Rhone-Alpes (FR) earlier this year. It's extremely short but packs an amazing lot of punch - it's actually an insane air-time machine considering its size, while remaining a perfect family coaster.
http://rcdb.com/12954.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Alton Towers will probably have 2 to 3 times the $$$ in investment for their new addition, I am very excited to see what will come to us

Does this article mean SW8 is not going to be a GCI woodie ????

http://www.dailyitem.com/news/northumbe ... dc1d4.html