SW6 / Thirteen - Ride & Construction discussion Part 2

[wburgess]

Credit where credit is due. The post does brilliantly sum up the past 200 odd pages of discussion and does a lovely job of directly tying it up with good evidence.

But please remember, that all of these ideas have been orchestrated by previous posters and most of the debating and deducing has come from other commited members (i'm not including myself in this btw!) in previous posts.

So credit to Mick for writing a well constructed summary of discussed ideas and credit to the regular TTF community who have done a great job of interpreting the dribbles of information Alton has given us.

But then again... we could all be very very wrong...

(p.s. I'll give a cookie to every member who thinks there will be a 3d screen if that does indeed happen! see my post a page back...)

[Khalichanan]

Absolutely brilliant!
I totally agree with Dominique, I would give anything to go to a lecture like that!


Seriously though, that was so good and well thought out, yet you wrote it in such a way I wasn't completely lost.
Oh no! I actually think you're so right that you may have, not spoiled it for me exactly, but I think I may know what to expect!

Take it as a compliment, it was that good!

[sibic]

glass less 3d Disney is installing this in star tours 2 as heard on the season pass pod cast talking about d30 i think last Disney expo...

[Anonymous]

First post, been a fan of this site for many years - just had to say WOW what a great post that was Mick, it really seems plausable that is what will happen, hope so ! cant wait to find out when i go on 31st March <!-- s]

[cmpunk771]

FANTASTIC POST,

There is just one problem i find, there are many drop towers in the US and i am sure that its over 0.5secs and it snt that scary?

[Jon]

Though I know every ride has hiccoughs when they're first built, and that its not even properly finished yet etc. etc., but these minor technical difficulties do concern me a little.

We know this ride is technically challenging, but I am worried as to how much this will affect reliability. I really hope its not another ride that seems to become notorious for breakdowns. Though I know practically every ride has troubles, rides like Air and Rita I always join queues for with baited breath, due to experience, half expecting it to break down.

There's not an awful lot you can do about breakdowns, it is just sad that, until the thing gets built, its an almost flawless idea. As soon as its concrete, it is open to become linked with problems. I'd hate it for it to become that kind of ride.

[AstroDan]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts on Thirteen Mick. Excellent way to come onto the Forum.

[Mick]

...please remember, that all of these ideas have been orchestrated by previous posters and most of the debating and deducing has come from other commited members (i'm not including myself in this btw!) in previous posts.

I absolutely agree and would not wish to take anything away from that. I did acknowledge in my post that I had drawn together loads of ideas and images from other forum members. The synchronization (of the train) was my idea though - as well as the more wildly speculative elements at the end

But then again... we could all be very very wrong...

I'm almost sure that it will be more wrong than anyone can imagine!

Thanks to everyone for your messages of support - you have given me the conviction to leave lurking behind for good (on this forum at least)

[Jimsmells]

[quote=""cmpunk771""]FANTASTIC POST,

There is just one problem i find, there are many drop towers in the US and i am sure that its over 0.5secs and it snt that scary?[/quote]

That's why Brendan Walker says it's only scary for the half a second, any longer than that and fear is replaced with excitement. And remember if it is a drop it will be sudden.

[cmpunk771]

After changing my thirteen preview weekend booking to the 20th the lady said the ride is not definitely going to open and it is subject to availability, so its looking doubtful for opening weekend

[Mick]

[quote=""Dominique""]Mick that post was brilliant, your students are so lucky I would love to be in that rollercoaster physics lecture...wow! [/quote]

Thank you. Anyone would be welcome to come next time (if you don't mind a bit of maths..)

However, I don't wish to advertise my place of work on the internet If anyone is interested, pm me closer to the time and I'll give you the details. It might not be a viable journey for you though, dependent on where you live!

---- Post Info Added ----

[quote=""wburgess""]Great well thought out first post.[/quote]
Thank you.

Whilst I share some of your misgivings about the possibility of 3D being involved, I do disagree with some of your objections.

the "sweet spot" required for the desired effect is quite restrictive.

agreed

dependant on distance from screen rather than angle. In a long trains case, this surely would not work.

Perhaps, but imagine this. As the train moves toward the screen, there is a portion of it within the sweet spot. As it is moving, you could calculate the optimal speed for the highest percentage of riders' time within this region. Not a perfect solution, but a plausible one.

Anyone with one weak eye etc... will not be able to witness the desired effect so it will be lost of them. I'm sure AT would not go down such a audience limiting route.

Then surely the big visual technology manufacturers would be well advised to stay away from implementing this as well?

c/ The technology is exclusive to Philips and is called 3d wowvx. I don't think it would be easy for AT to use this technology when it isn't even on general release.

I'm afraid this isn't entirely accurate. Whilst Philips' particular implementation of the technology, 3D WowVX it seems in this case, might be exclusive to them, the technology itself is not. Indeed, a brief survey of the internet reveals a plethora of such devices. The Wikipedia entry on autosteroscopy is a good place to start looking.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autostereoscopy
The example I saw (I cannot remember the manufacturer) was pretty good. Having said that, personally I cannot see this technology catching on in the home, past the novelty stage. I imagine it will remain a preserve of virtual reality applications, product design and of course leisure entertainment!

a screen using 3dwowvx at that scale be... very expensive!

Yes - an LCD or plasma enlarged to that size would give Bill Gates a cause to think twice! However, the same effect can be achieved with systems of projectors directed at a lenticular surface, or through a parallax mask. The first examples of this technology were done this way. This arrangement is not significantly more expensive than existing projection systems, at the sophisticated end of the scale anyway.

e/ View of riders near the back of the train would be obscured.

This is perhaps the best argument against 3D, as I would imagine that they could have altered the layout of the train to compensate for this, even if just a little. I see no suggestion of such an adaptation on the trains. However, the view would not be obscured more than that of a conventional display from the back of the train.

Sorry, more reasons than I intended to first write!

No problem, it's always worthwhile to bounce ideas around.

I'm not saying that I don't share some of your reservations myself, but I still see the use of 3D on this ride as a distinct and realizable possibility.

[Nightfall]

Well you’re not at my Uni. I would have remembered a lecture like that.
I should probably also note that I no someone with one weak eye but they’re not a roller coaster fan so I expect both eyes will be tight shut anyway.


It sounds like the "minor technical difficulties" are not quite as minor as they are suggesting. First the Boot camp now the preview weekend and I notice some members have been told that the ride might still be unavailable on opening day.

It sounds like the problem is one that has proved challenging to solve as the decision to cancel the preview weekend came rather suddenly. Only yesterday they were asking us are names to put on the welcome packs. Alton has done so well up to now, it’s such a shame things have started to go wrong.

The good news is that technical difficulties mean the ride is likely to offer something very unique.

[James B]

I would just like to say again thanks to Craig for sorting my username and password out again! Will endeavour to remember it this time

On topic, Mick i think you are spot on with your prediction of the ride, and i am really hoping this is what happens as it could be the worlds best coaster.

Following the press release it sounds more to me like its the themeing and the area that need more work than the ride itself. I hope no corners are cut and that the themeing does match the conecpt art. I do though think they are pushing it now for opening day.

On a side note, usually how busy is it on the 1st monday after opening weekend?

[wburgess]

^^^ Mick, sorry I had assumed that Philips were the only company with the use of lenses and not glasses to produce 3d. On the cost side of things, I feel that the optics would surely bare the brunt of the price.

Whatever is inside that building will have to be very immersive, however they go about it!

I'm sure the problems with the ride are mainly theme based. The photos from the half term openings show that a lot still needed to be done. I don't think AT have even mentioned there are problems, just quick assumptions on our behalf.

I'm sure all will be fine and dandy, they just want it looking its best before opening, which i'm sure you would too if you had just spend 15mil (?) on it... mind you, going back to Air's tunnel...:P

Oh, also, the problem about peoples eyesight effecting 3d, its a real problem and one of the main reasons I don't feel 3d tv will take off as much as people expect.

[Nightfall]

[quote=""wburgess""]I'm sure the problems with the ride are mainly theme based. The photos from the half term openings show that a lot still needed to be done. I don't think AT have even mentioned there are problems, just quick assumptions on our behalf.[/quote]
Unfortunately Morwenna Angove did mention that "we have experienced some minor technical difficulties during testing" in the most resent message.

The only problem is that if the ride is still testing then I hope they don't rush the final scenery. Remember that according to the schedule the ride should have been fully operational by the 3rd/4th. Not rushing the dark forest theme could be the reason they postponed the preview event, not wanting fans to see only half the effect.

[nemesisfan]

I can't help but think the worst, that being th13een isn't going to be ready for it's open day March 20th and I pray to god it is as I have the weekend booked off work [-o< .

If it is so that it's just minor touch ups to the actual Dark Forest area and not the ride itself why would they cancel the preview weekend? Anyway fingers crossed it isn't a major problem to the ride , the worst thing that could happen is the ride been put back. It's been long enough, I don't think I can wait any longer.

Roll on March 20th for now

[Wes]

Bootcamp - Cancelled

Preview Weekend - Cancelled



Minor issues? Themeing issues? I think not.

From the impression that I get, there have been issues with the ride, hence themeing hasn't been complete with the area (the ride hasn't been handed over). So it looks as if, unless the issues with the ride aren't ironed out soon, the ride can't be handed over & themeing can't be completed.

Ready by the 20th? Doubtful.

[Javs]

If it were simply due to it being behind schedule due to weather, then they would not have mentioned the technical nature of the ride. From that letter, they are clearly suffering from technical issues as well as time scale issues.

[Elliot]

It better had be ready by the 20th, as I'm going for that weekend and I'm only really going for Th13teen and I live down in Kent and all the money adds up to quite alot, Hotel, Petrol, Food & Drink, Gifts and more. And even if Alton were to do somesort of refund it wouldn't do the whole thing and then we would have to book to visit again and the weekend of the 20th is the only free time I have for about 12weeks. I hope for the best for the 20th.

[cmpunk771]

There website says "push your luck on Thirteen"

Push your luck its open