The Smiler - Speculation

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Johno
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Blaze wrote: I don't think they need to show the theming. There's a seperate document called "Theming dimensions" which show the size of them, so submitting another one doesn't really make much sense, as they'd have to show the measurements again anyway. Being in the GDO, I'm not sure they'd need to be too specific, unless there's some sort of effects involved.
The GDO only covers buildings up to a height of 10m. Therefore these structures, which are bigger, have to be given in detail.

I would imagine, that they have to be uploaded/shown to the public.
Big Dave

If this ride does have a launch, that is powered via LSMs, they don't need to draw the power directly from the grid. They can take a small amount of power over a period of time, store it all up and then release all the electrical power in one go. Works similar on Rita. Constantly pumps oil into an accumulator and the releases it.
Poison Tom 96

I personally think this ride will have completely new carriages.

For a worlds first at one of the best theme parks it needs a good throughput.
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The Psychoaster
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I wouldn't have thought much power would have to be used for LIM/LSM launches? As far as I am aware, although there are a lot of magnets on both the train and the track, only the ones on the track have to be powered as electromagnets, and only a relatively low current has to be passed through them for this to occur.
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Coaster_Dude
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The Psychoaster wrote: I wouldn't have thought much power would have to be used for LIM/LSM launches? As far as I am aware, although there are a lot of magnets on both the train and the track, only the ones on the track have to be powered as electromagnets, and only a relatively low current has to be passed through them for this to occur.
I was under the impression that the opposite was true, that it takes a lot of energy and electricity to power the motors and launch a vehicle with them.
Big Dave

I don't think it takes that much power, but its still a fair amount of demand to have all in one go. Im certain most LSM/LIM launches save up power in like a large battery and then release it when needed.
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Boz
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LIMs require an enormous amount of power to launch.
thorpe originally wanted a LIM launched coaster on the inferno site, but were informed that neither the chertsey grid nor the staines grid could take the strain of it. apparantley it would have shut down half of staines everytime they launched it
Big Dave

Gertslauer say that their launched coasters need between 200kw and 300kw continuous power with a power storage system fitted. Their normal Eurofighters require around 150kw continuous. So not really a massive increase.
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They have probably improved over time, but at one point they were oftern deemed too expensive and power hungry for the UK. I would imagine that a lot more power is needed to launch a vehical from a standstill vertically than is for a straght or rolling launch though.

I'm still very doubtful we're going to see another proper launch though. You only have to stand in Woodcutters and watch Rita launch to see what an impact it has (Usually the lights all flicker and dim when it launches/is readying for a launch :P )
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Big Dave

Don't see how that is physically possible Bote. Rita uses hydraulic pressure that is built up over a period of time. It doesn't need a sudden amount of electrical power during the launch.
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Stand in Woodcutters. The lights flicker almost every time Rita launches. It's a little too coincidental if you ask me.
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Nemesis94
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Apologies that it's been a while coming, but my No Limits recreation is now available to download. I don't post often, but like some of my others, this one is pretty epic.

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I wanted to give my model a bit more of an X-Sector feel to it, so I've added a little bit of themeing to the station and given the cars unique textures. I've also created a quick Oblivion-esque logo, based on the look of the batwing/cobra element:
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My logo:
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Station with minor theming added:
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I'd quite like to see the cars as mini Oblivion shuttles, so their design has been inspired as such. I've plastered the logo all over them and given them hazard arrows. The theme for these being Black and White, instead of Black and Orange. There are now 8 of these in the recreation: timed so that when operating smoothly there are 4 are out on the course, and 4 in the station (presumably with 2 loading and 2 unloading).
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Since we now think it will use normal Eurofighter track, I've converted some sections to the more likely ladder track. Most noteably the brakes, lifts and the track abover the WC's. Due to the way the ride has to span the existing WC's and that there are only minor drops here, it is my best guess that it will use ladder track. Just up to the two drops.
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Another view showing the track abover the WC's:
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I've also tweaked the snack hut in the queue and stilted platfrom from the white blobs that were previously visible on my old version.

The queue is one serious cattle-pen:
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I've also added a quick representation of the arched entrance.
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I've also been doing a little bit of tweaking here and there the past few days to get it working as I wanted. The main issue being with the lifts. My old model (the one in the POV) was based on consecutive cars dueling. So if the cars were numbered 1-8, car 3 would duel with car 2 first, then car 4. But the problem with this, is that it means the gap between each car must include the lift time. In other words, cars can only despatch every 45 seconds or so.

I have now altered the the blocking so that car 3 would duel with car 1 first, and then car 5. This has reduced the despatch time to a car every 35 seconds. It also gives more realistic operation. If you watch the POV, the car immediately engaged the vertical lift to start its climb. But if you watch any Eurofighter it always stops at the base at the lift, probably to ensure the block beyond is clear so the car doesn't have to stop and re-start on the vertical. So when you start the simulator, be aware that the first car to duel twice will be the third car despatched.

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Hence the cars do run more realistically, the only problem now is that there is quite a pause at the end of the first half, as you wait to be allowed on to the vertical lift. It's about 20 seconds or so. So if this really does happen I'd hope there'd be some theming element prior to the vertical lift, a bit like SAW has the video screens before it's tower. What could be more interesting is if this part was buried in a tunnel, so you do a reverse oblivion and rise vertically out of the ground. I think that would be pretty cool.

Also, it is worth noting that due to the limitations in No Limits (!?!) the cars do not allows duel in the same way. No Limits always gives a slight variation in despatch times, even though I've given it restrictions. So sometimes the vertical lift is slightly ahead, sometimes it's behind. But the overall effect is pretty much the same.

So with despatch time at around 35 seconds, throughput for the ride will be approximately 800pph. This is based on the ride using standard Eurofighter cars:
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If they were to have an extra row, this would increase throughput by 50% to 1200pph. I'm sure with more programming the despatch time can be reduced a little, but it will always be limited by the length of the final part of the ride. It takes approximately 35 seconds from the top of the vertical lift to clearing the final breaks. That is if my recreation is running at truly realistic speeds...

There is more I could do to improve the recration, but even the modifictions I've just done has taken many hours. So it's over to you to improve on it and, well, do whatever you want with it. Oh, you will notice my track isn't the smoothest, so you might want to tweak that as your first priority. My station building model is also quite rough, and the roll on the way to the first lift was added as a bit of fun.

So here is the link to the zip file, be sure to read the instructions first so that it will load properly:
http://www.mediafire.com/?i41c07sbznntkoo

Enjoy the ride...
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PS: If you have any problems downloading or using the files, please let me know.
Last edited by Nemesis94 on Wed Feb 01, 2012 8:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
See my No Limits recreation of SW7 (filmed by JAMMYD777) at
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Bote
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That is some seriously amazing NL work right there! I absolutly love the logo! :D

*goes to download* :P
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RyanY
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I must say your SW7 recreation is truly awesome and I hope the actual ride is rides as good as your recreation. Just 1 question, do you need the full no limits to have a look at this, will it run on the demo version?

Anyway as regards to throughout I don't think that we should get that worried. AT know what their doing and I think that this will at least have better throughput than Rita or it will have awful queues. But I hope I'll have a better or the same as th13teen because that deals with queues quite well think.
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Nightfall
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It looks really good, nice job.

In other news I've just been watching one of the videos for IAAPA 2011. Gerstlauer made quite an interesting statement to TPR. Firstly it seems they're making a real push for all their new rides to be designed with Lap bars, including retrofitting older designs on request. Second and more importantly their representative claimed the Lap bars on Dare Devil Dive were only the first design and that a second design has already been developed. Sounds interesting...
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Blaze

Oh god yes. Lap bars on this would be ridiculous. :D
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James
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Lap bars would certainly be the way to go, and gives a whole new appeal to guests at Alton... brings in the fear factor more closely.
Dormiens-Dave

Lapbars should also help reduce any GerstAche and said impact on the rest of the ride
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ATJoseph
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Yes kinda comfirms we will have Lap-Bars!  :)
That recreation is amazing i have already downloaded it well done nemesis94!

But back on topic i think maybe this ride will have the lift-hill and then afterwards a vertical launch so you get the best of both worlds.

On another note i hope the rides name is The Secret Weapon Or The Void!  :)
Last edited by ATJoseph on Sun Jan 29, 2012 10:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Blaze

If either lift is going to launch, it really isn't going to be the vertical one. It makes no sense at all.
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