2012 operational cuts

[AstroDan]

That's just the setting. It will still have had more power, I am sure.

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[Kaycee]

I find it worrying that they seem to have been left with no choice but to go down this path again, after the outrage from the visiting public last time. I do heavily disagree with watering down the experience for people who go on quieter days.
But I imagine that people's anger being directed at Alton is pointless. It's dismaying how much Merlin are penny-pinching tight-arses - hopefully getting enough complaints from guests will change things, but sadly I don't think enthusiast reaction is going to get anywhere this time. They've done it before, they know what to expect... and yet, they've done it again.

[Spike]

Some good points from both, although I dispute the issue on meets - aside from some joking about with Sub Terra, I don't generally feel people attack the park on meets, perhaps some sarcasm, but nothing malicious certainly.

Not so bad when it's within the group, I'd agree. But when it's shouted through a mega-phone for all to hear? I think it's idiotic and looks bad on the park & the group. I'm not a kill-joy, but ruining the experience for guests on park in Hex, Terry and in various other locations isn't on really.

Besides Terry is win!  [-(  :P

[James]

Great post Spike! You make some good points which I agree with, and some other points which I do not. Just a few little things I want to pick up on.

Yes, I agree it can be tiring without the Skyride, but there wasn't this outcry when the Skyride was down for a combined season with the fires was there?

There wasn't an outcry after the fires mainly due to that fact that both fires were out of Alton Towers' hands. It's not like they deliberately set the stations on fire. In this case it's purely a decision made by management, it's not something out of their control, you could argue it is, however they have many other ways of going around it. I understand that closing the Skyride is easy though, in terms of it will save more money than closing, say, several attractions.

I for one think a happy medium would be to keep the Skyride open and close Submission & Enterprise blocking it off as part of the reconstruction and build of SW&.

I was thinking about this last night, and I agree with this. I'm slightly miffed myself at the closure of the Skyride on off-peak days. Submission and Enterprise staying SBNO all year and using SW7 as an excuse would have been an easier thing to do, and Alton could have easily gotten away with it. I remember a few months back some members were certain that Sub and Ents would be closed due to SW7 construction. So it's something that could have been easily done. In this case though, at the present time, it still would be a good idea. Although I somehow doubt Alton will go back to that decision, mainly to save themselves from looking like idiots for going back on decisions... and I'm sure the forum would light up with anger again if that did happen.

It just seems these days that once one person jumps on the band-wagon the rest follow and it turns into one big headache, many people are not posting their concerns with any real thought and are just jumping on said band wagon to push Towers around again, it's sickening. I'm not saying that peoples concerns are unjust, but it's the way in which these situations are turning up and the anti-Alton campaign starts again.   

I agree with you partly here. There are some top quality posters on here, who make very valid and constructive posts with regards to Alton Towers. However I know it's sad to say, now and again the 'anti-Alton' brigade comes into action. Generally some will follow the bandwagon for the sakes of it, as a way of feeling a part of the majority. Although other members, such as yourself Spike, I respect more - mainly due to the fact you go against the majority, which I like, it's what makes a forum more exciting for me.
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In my own summary Alton Towers have had yet another hard season. Cost cutting has now hit ride operations, which I'm certain the manager at Alton have tried to avoid at all costs, although sadly it's gotten to the point where they have to take these risky decisions in order to comply with the budget cuts ordered by Merlin. It does directly affect guests, it will cause complaints, although what can they do? Alton Towers is stuck now, whatever rides they close, however many different cuts they make this forum and the public will continue in uproar against Alton's decisions.

At the end of the day, this is it, we have to accept that Alton Towers can no longer afford to operate at full capacity. We may not like it, it may affect our visits - but until they find a way of cutting operations that do not directly affect guests, or until the park/Merlin gets sold off we have to, just like the Tussauds dark years, accept it and carry on as usual. This decision is not something that would have been taken lightly, the managers at Alton would have carefully thought about this, how it will affect guests, how the park will be presented... I think we need to remember that the Skyride is one of the more expensive attractions to operate, so it's a big money saver in the long run. They have clearly opted for this as opposed to closing several attractions or cutting hours (as we have seen already done and reverted back to in both cases).

Moan all you like, send emails/letters to Merlin. All I will say is, if/when the closure of the Skyride is a decision that is reverted, just expect in a few weeks time to hear the closure of another ride/attraction. It's a vicious circle, Alton Towers have no choice but to do this.

[AstroDan]

I think its mainly just people having a laugh.

People here love Alton. It just shows itself in a variety of forms.



Edit - can't they just close Charlie?

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[Spike]

I was thinking about this last night, and I agree with this. I'm slightly miffed myself at the closure of the Skyride on off-peak days. Submission and Enterprise staying SBNO all year and using SW7 as an excuse would have been an easier thing to do, and Alton could have easily gotten away with it.

They really should have done this. They could have gotten away with it and saved themselves a lot of headaches and backlash. It could have easily been disguised in with SW7's construction.

I agree with you partly here. There are some top quality posters on here, who make very valid and constructive posts with regards to Alton Towers. However I know it's sad to say, now and again the 'anti-Alton' brigade comes into action. Generally some will follow the bandwagon for the sakes of it, as a way of feeling a part of the majority. Although other members, such as yourself Spike, I respect more - mainly due to the fact you go against the majority, which I like, it's what makes a forum more exciting for me.

I don't go against the grain always or on purpose, I just have a different outlook on Alton as I don't visit nearly enough as much as many do here and I always love my visits. I also don't have rose tinted lenses on either. I have found many of Alton's & Merlin's decisions insane, especially the introduction of the two separate Merlin passes. This came to bite me in the ass at Warwick Castle last week when I had to pay £12.60 for the extra attractions on top of my standard pass, when my Mum & Sister used a BOGOF and paid £15 for everything.

The greed of Merlin is shocking but I do feel empathy for Alton as you can clearly see they're trying and willing to listen despite pressure from Merlin to up-sell & cost cut. If you ask me the anger should be directed towards Merlin & not Alton. 

[Dormiens-Dave]

Based on the recently discovered late opening at Lego adding to those at Towers, Thorpe and Chessie i really think the Investors are getting ready to float Merlin on the stock exchange...

[Spike]

Based on the recently discovered late opening at Lego adding to those at Towers, Thorpe and Chessie i really think the Investors are getting ready to float Merlin on the stock exchange...

Is this a good thing or a bad thing though? I can't quite decide.

[Bote]

Well hopefully when Merlin floats the company will be broken down and sold. E.G. Parks go one way, midways another. I can't see there being many people who want to take up a whole company as one. It'd make more sense to package brands and groups up. Plus, if you look at it that way it means there's no money being taken from all the parks to be squandered on pointless midways around the world...

I hope... :P

[lozzyhickers]

I was disgusted to see at TT@10 the level of hatred for attractions & the park itself so freely on display, people shouting jibes & ruining experiences for guests & other members to fuel their own narcissistic needs. It begs the question, why on earth do many of you keep visiting if you despise the park so much? I will say it's mini meets for me in future as it was the only thing that ruined my weekend.

You've summed up what i've been thinking for months. It makes me ashamed to be a member sometimes 
It's not everyone, but a select few that have stopped me from ever wanting to go to a meet.

[James]

I don't go against the grain always or on purpose, I just have a different outlook on Alton as I don't visit nearly enough as much as many do here and I always love my visits. I also don't have rose tinted lenses on either. I have found many of Alton's & Merlin's decisions insane, especially the introduction of the two separate Merlin passes. This came to bite me in the ass at Warwick Castle last week when I had to pay £12.60 for the extra attractions on top of my standard pass, when my Mum & Sister used a BOGOF and paid £15 for everything.

The greed of Merlin is shocking but I do feel empathy for Alton as you can clearly see they're trying and willing to listen despite pressure from Merlin to up-sell & cost cut. If you ask me the anger should be directed towards Merlin & not Alton.

Oh yes, I know you don't go against the grain on purpose, most of your views I agree with myself. I guess the point I was trying to make is that some members on here join the hate bandwagon for the sake of it, even if they have an opposite view to the majority - and the only reason they do this is because they do not want to get lynched or attacked by other members (which I have seen in the past, things do turn personal when it's one/two members versus 10+ members it can get messy, if not personal, at least to the point where a discussion become an unpleasant argument). I've always enjoyed reading peoples opposing views, like yours. Although I do find it sad sometimes how people join a bandwagon for the sake of it. You can usually tell who these people are too as they have nothing constructive to add, or practically copy other peoples views/posts. 

I do agree the anger needs to be more swayed toward Merlin. Even though this is a Alton management decision, it's because of Merlin they have had to come to this decision. I'm sure as we all know the management team at Alton do want to satisfy guests and have some great ideas/things they want to do at the resort. Although due to Merlin they are doing nothing they want to do, and even worse, not being able to run the theme park the way they want it to (and the way it should) be run.

That's not to say Alton Towers are perfect at everything they do, as they have messed some things up in the past, however in this case Merlin is at fault.

[Spike]

Oh yes, I know you don't go against the grain on purpose, most of your views I agree with myself. I guess the point I was trying to make is that some members on here join the hate bandwagon for the sake of it, even if they have an opposite view to the majority - and the only reason they do this is because they do not want to get lynched or attacked by other members (which I have seen in the past, things do turn personal when it's one/two members versus 10+ members it can get messy, if not personal, at least to the point where a discussion become an unpleasant argument). I've always enjoyed reading peoples opposing views, like yours. Although I do find it sad sometimes how people join a bandwagon for the sake of it. You can usually tell who these people are too as they have nothing constructive to add, or practically copy other peoples views/posts.

That to me is the issue why I hardly post anymore. But you know me I can hold my own and TAKE THEM ALL ON! lol :evillaugh:

Seriously though, band-wagoning seems common place now for fear of being lynched like you said.

[oldgitBEN]

Again I disagree spike!

Look at the response your post has had, genuine, non band-wagon responses, that are reflective, intelligent and how the place normally is.

[mrbrightside]

I don't actually think that the majority are bandwagon-ing, I think that people genuinely are angered by the decision. Whilst the park clearly has no choice, it doesn't make people sympathetic to the cause if they are genuinely angry at the choice that has been made. Whether it is the right one could be debated for hours and hours, but the cut had to come somewhere clearly.

I also think that the majority of members on here understand that it is not Alton's fault, rather it is Merlin's (or Merlin's investors). So whilst anger may come across as Alton bashing - I think it is actually rage against the way Merlin are running their theme parks.

As someone who feels that they may have reacted slightly OTT previously in this thread, I would like to apologise if it sounded cringeworthy or like I was hopping on a bandwagon, as I was not. I was simply airing my grievances at the fact that Merlin have clearly kept hounding Alton for a cut to their operating budget. A budget that is clearly not big enough to cover the parks operations.

[Blaze]

Is it bandwagon jumping? Or just people getting fed up of the constant stupid decisions?

I don't think there's any bandwagon jumping going on here. It's clear to everyone how serious this decision is, I think the reaction is completely genuine.

[Ritadz]

Seriously though, band-wagoning seems common place now for fear of being lynched like you said.

Being one of the people on TTF who is regarded as a "Merlin basher", I would like to make sure you know that my views are 100% my own and I'm in no way band-wagoning or just following the crowd, infact I was probably the first TTF'ers to hate M£rlin/Blackstone. :P

I hate the company(s) for the reasons stated in earlier post, they are a bunch of fat cats with little to no regard to the paying guest. While It's evident many people on TTF disagree with my views on M£rlin, these views are my own and completely genuine. I will continue to voice my concerns over the well-being of the park until M£rlin get their act together or are out of the park. While I myself am fit and perfectly able to walk around the park for a full day, many people are unable to and rely on the Skyride. As many people have stated imagine being in the situation of either a wheelchair user or a parent with a pushchair. The Skyride is practically a must for those people, and people need to consider that.

[DiogoJ42]

Well, at the risk of sounding like I'm jumping on the bandwagon here... I too, am not jumping on any bandwagons.
Like Ritadz, I have long been a critic of M£rlin, and this is just the latest in a long line of proof that all they care about is profit.

[James]

I can't post much now as I'm not near a computer or laptop.

However my comments regarding bandwagons is not to say everyone in here is on the bandwagon. So Adz and Diogo, I don't think you two are a part of this 'bandwagon', you both have shown a disagreement towards the operations and workings of Merlin for a long while.

My comments refer to those who do not post their views freely on here, as I said, in fear of being lynched or attacked by the majority. Some of these members even pretend to agree with the majority, joining the bandwagon for the sake of it purely because they feel in certain topics they cannot post their true views, how they really feel about the topic in hand.

It has happened in this topic. I'm not saying that everyone is following each other like a herd of sheep, I'm not saying that everyone is following a bandwagon. I'm simply saying that some members are following the majority for the sake of it, for whatever reason.

Since this is now highly off topic (yes I know I'm guilty of beginning this off topic-ness) it's time we get back onto the topic of the Skyride.

If any of you wish to continue the bandwagon debate then feel free to make a new topic in one of the relevant forums. Or if you wish to reply to my post then send me a PM.


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[BigAl]

Whenever something happens to lessen a day at Alton Towers then I'll always make a comment. I love to go on the Skyride across the park because it provides some fantastic views of the surroundings and it has become an iconic part of the park. This decision hasn't pleased me, and I'm not surprised that most others aren't happy either.

Merlin do make some good choices, but often they make choices that have a negative effect on things and I don't... I can't agree with that. Merlin are making big profits, all while closing certain areas, rides and even whole parks for certain periods of time across the UK and it isn't very fair on people that have paid all of that money to enjoy their attractions fully.

Yes, it is their prerogative to close things whenever they like without prior warning because it's clear in their T's & C's, but should they? Especially on this scale? And it doesn't look good when some smaller parks aren't making these kinds of choices.

But the latest Legoland cuts are much worse and they make the limited availablity of the Skyride look trivial in comparison (seriously, about 1/3 of the park will be closed on off-peak dates ).

Have any cuts been made at any of their international attractions, such as Gardaland or Heide Park, etc...?

[Dormiens-Dave]

You know comments going on about negativity  really wind me up, 99.9% of the time TT is very balanced and respectful to the park and really only criticises what genuinly needs to be. Even EP's forums do that and that themepark is about as faultless as you can get.

There is some loud fooling around on park which on Hex and Sub-Terra i don't like if any regular guests are on with us but really if you can't deal with a balanced forum and ignore the 5 or 6 "haters" then i don't know which towers forum will suit you.

I'm sick of defending this forum on the basis of 5 or 6 consistantly negative posters when most people are only negative when it's justified. I would rather have a constructive forum than a blindly fanboyish one!