Nemesis: Sub-Terra Discussion (**contains spoilers**)

[Mattia]

I think some comments regarding the GP in this topic are really shocking and unfair. After all we ARE part of the GP too, we're not some superior life form.

Dealing with the theatre as part of my studies, we become concious of just how aware we must be of our audience's attention and how hard it is to retain it.

Let's put it this way, imagine the GP are a pyramid. You have different "deepness-levels", levels which are a person's ability to really connect with a piece on a very strange and deep level, sometimes the level can be so deep it almost seems weird or inhumane.

The pyramid goes from extremely-deep (click) to not even cutting the surface (click).

Theatre must reach out to all these pyramid levels in its different forms and none of those levels are "cleverer" or "dumber" than the other). The actors or company decide just how much they want to use their audience. Do they want them to think and work it out? Thus, doing the hard work? Or do they want them to simply watch it and have all the information fed to them?

Unfortunately, Alton Towers must approach each attraction with extreme caution and clarity. Unlike the more refined genre's within theatre which the GP choose to view or not, this isn't the case for Alton Towers. They need to cater to all levels of the pyramid, they need to entertain and they need to capture the imagination and excitement from their audience in as many simple ways as possible whilst realising their audience come from all levels of the pyramid.

Because people don't observe the televisions throughout Sub Terra does not mean that the GP are "stupid", it means that in order for them to appreciate the experience instead of switching-off, Alton Towers need to explain everything they can as precisely, repeatedly, thoroughly and quickly as they can. They need to have tune-in points throughout the attraction, where a wandering member of the GP suddenly tunes back in and can quickly regain some form of knowledge regarding the experience they are about to become a part of. For example, we are made aware of the lower chamber, lifts and observation area three times - first in the queue line videos, second in the batching area and thirdly in the lift. This isn't added to prolong video or experience time but it's there for the benefit of it's guests and to once again reiterate the experience. A really clever tune in point is the test evacuation procedure on the queue line tv's. It has a dual purpose, to create a form of tension/hint at future events and also to reignite the audience member's interest in the TV information. Every time I've been in the queue line and the alarm sounds you see many different GP members look up towards the TV and regain interest.

So, they may not properly observe the queue-line videos or the batching video or even the lift audio, but it doesn't mean Alton has failed and it doesn't mean the GP has either but that's all Towers can do - they can't force anyone to shut up and listen. The main experience is therefore needed to bring them back into the concept. Cue the unmissable pre-drop chamber scene and spiel.

I may write down rules/info for my audience to read on a scroll i give them, I may have a flickering tv screen also displaying these rules and even a repeating voice-over but sometimes even another actor who knows about the piece, will break them. It's what happens within performance and there is nothing we can do about it but continue. The audience only ever get out of the theatre what they put in and Sub Terra applies to this too. As James has said, "We're not being told the story, we ARE the story." and that's so so true. So, the story will only be as effective as the amount of effort and concentration YOU put into it. 

Sub Terra captures narrative and experience on a level not seen in the UK yet - a bold move for Alton Towers. It even dares to go and break the boundaries. It has become experimental in it's story unfolding with you as the main subjects, as well as the emotions of fear, panic and unease forming throughout the experience scenes - NOT from the outset. Something very risky and only previously achieved in actor-lead walk through attractions where the outcome is dependant on your reactions and observations.

Everything Sub Terra does is clever and different in terms of what UK theatrical rides have to offer. The others make us go on a journey of a story and how we need to watch this and observe that and then ride this and then end it like that. But no, Sub Terra briefs us, makes us explore and then begin to observe. But it goes wrong and now WE become subjects to the monster and effectively "write" the experience's terror from the moment we drop into the pit until the ending of the decontamination zone.

Like theatre, it also needs tweaks and refinements to ensure the experience is accessible, immersive and understandable to as many as possible. Once the decontamination zone is implemented properly in their explanations - the ride will be on top form in terms of just how much it can possibly achieve informing us the GP.

[Morgano]

I enjoyed the new Sub Terra, for me however the majority of the additional actors at the end, added very little to the experience. On emerging from the lifts the actor shining a torch in your face is brilliant, it feels just like you've entered a high security decontamination zone... then it all goes wrong. The maze is tight, the low ceiling, everything is just wrong, everyone filters through the maze slowly.  The high pressured air pumps are great but the additional actors behind the mesh are pointless and a waste of money. Are they zombies? Dead? or Guards? some of them had blood, the day I went they were all dressed as guards... it just wasn't clear enough. I see in the video that one is now dressed as a regular person (this is slightly better). The continuity of having a guard screening you then instantly having zombie/dead guards seemed silly and out of place in such a small zone/space.

[gaz1313]

Went on today, after riding it originally and being very disappointed.

After riding the MUCH updated version today, I think we left the park with a smile and a high that lasted for an hour! I'm very very impressed with what the ride is now. It actually does have a fear factor, which, before, made the ride seem very half finished. It makes me wonder if that was what was originally designed to be implemented, but they ran out of time to build the final, well, large bits in.

However, I do wonder how they could make it last, say in 5 years time, with the amount of people needed, ie, one at the start for the intro, and the 4/5 at the end in the maze. Most bits'll have to be pre-recorded, and the maze'll probably become only a walkthrough with some sounds.

But I was very impressed.

[AdrenalineAlex]

maybe the countdown is the time in which the lift is closing in order to create a sense of panic? but this would be made ineffective if people thought it would be funny to walk very slowly to the lift so when it hits 1 the doors don't close.

Going off what you said Alex, which I hope happens, as people leave the exit elevators, like said, it counts down to the doors closing, when they have closed an idea would be to have Nemesis roar, and then have the sound of the elevators dropping and crashing, followed by a small scene, then the exit though the shipping container? Any thoughts?

Sorry I've only just seen this reply! I think that could be an idea but I suppose we're meant to leave it to the riders imagination of what they think it sounds like but it would be good if in the middle of the lift scene there was a black out in the lift and it felt like it was moving as if the cord was going to snap after the panels break? The panic you would feel that the lift would snap and you'd fall to your death, then when you leave the elevators, it could be randomised every time, as the door closes one crashes (or makes a sound) that its fallen to the ground or something?

[BarryD]

Barry, I think that a gut feeling is preemptive  8)

Sir, you are indeed correct.

I should have went with "first impression post ride".

I stand corrected (pedant  )

[djtruefitt]

There has been a few minor alteractions in the maze at the end since the weekend, they have now cut some parts out of the metal fences so that the actors can lean out at you, and this works much better than just seeing actors behind a fence, as they now jump out at you.

[James]

Not sure if anyone has seen this image? It came out along with the PR stunt a few days ago.

[starbugger1303]

Just arrived back after a few hours on park.And I have to say it's improving even after the recent changes. There seems to be more smoke being pumped into the right hand side ascent lift, because when the lights went on, I could hardly see!

I don't know if it's been mention before, there is a 'Quarantine' sign above the start of the scare maze entrance.

Also, one of my favorite parts is watching people's reactions on the ride.. Today, there were quite of few people crying in the main chamber.

I love Sub Terra!

[Big Dave]

If people leave mentally scared for life, then the ride is good enough, otherwise it needs to be more scary :P

[Joelio]

Nice to see Towers still doing tweaks! I'm actually pretty excite about re-experiencing it again

[SAM93]

Also, one of my favorite parts is watching people's reactions on the ride.. Today, there were quite of few people crying in the main chamber.

I love Sub Terra!

Fully agree on this, that is very much how I spend of most of my time on the ride these days, watching others! It's fantastic to see peoples reactions and since the changes I have seen a fair few people being reduced to tears on the ride, especially in the final section through the shipping container!

Yesterday there was one girl who was trembling and almost vomiting the second she sat down on her tower, no offence to the poor girl, but she was a great one to watch, sadly I was not in her lift :P

As many know I have been a fan of Sub Terra since the very start, but now, I no longer need to hide my love for it as much The improvements are great and really do bring the attractions up to a far better standard, and even since Monday as others have mentioned little things are still being changed, such as the addition of more smoke and removal of sections of fence in the finale. It all adds to it and will hopefully help to make Sub Terra a very popular addition!

It truly is a great ride, a true experience. The improvements have worked wonders for the public's opinion of the ride, on one of my runs through it yesterday, I would say it got a 100% positive comments from the rest of the group!

On the whole, all I have to say is FANTASTIC!!!

[I'llookdownifiwanto]

Rode Sub Terra for the first time today, and I have to say, I thoroughly enjoyed it! I founit extremely scary, believable and immersive, it had a great story and there was that bit in the strobe maze at the end where the guy in the gas mask looked me straight in the eyes, and he had blood all over his face and looked like he really had radiation sickness or something, it really scared me! 9.5 out of ten

[starbugger1303]

Also, one of my favorite parts is watching people's reactions on the ride.. Today, there were quite of few people crying in the main chamber.

I love Sub Terra!

Yesterday there was one girl who was trembling and almost vomiting the second she sat down on her tower, no offence to the poor girl, but she was a great one to watch, sadly I was not in her lift :P

Well today, I saw a girl, about the age of 15-16, run out of the batching area...It was most probably the Phalanx operatives to be honest.. Some people just can't handle them...

:P

[BowMan]

How scary is this new scare maze on the end? I'm a bit of a scaredy cat when it comes to scare mazes :nervious:. I've been on Duel: Live without a problem but this seems to be a lot scarier...

[Longy]

On a scale of AT Scaremazes, would you say it's towards ToTT or Duel: Live, with CoS and BH in the middle?

I haven't been on it with the changes yet, so I would like to know what the general scares are like in comparison to get a feeling of what it will be like.

[starbugger1303]

How scary is this new scare maze on the end? I'm a bit of a scaredy cat when it comes to scare mazes :nervious:. I've been on Duel: Live without a problem but this seems to be a lot scarier...

Personally, I think it's VERY scary... Everytime I go on it. I come off weak at the knees.

[siralgenon]

How scary is this new scare maze on the end? I'm a bit of a scaredy cat when it comes to scare mazes :nervious:. I've been on Duel: Live without a problem but this seems to be a lot scarier...

Personally, I think it's VERY scary... Everytime I go on it. I come off weak at the knees.

I personally hate scare mazes, because I get scared of everything, and the 'maze' section of sub-terra doesn't bother me what so ever. Don't get me wrong im not saying it's crap, because it's great. But it is just a dark corridor with loud air blasts and Phalanx Operatives, it just makes you jump because of the air. 

[BowMan]

Thanks a lot guys! I should be going on Saturday so I'll tell you what I think.  :mrgreen:

[e4kenndr]

Have u guys all felt the air cannons like in Th13teen?

When i went through heard them but nothing felt, it was just the noises that scared me

[Bunbury]

It's scary, but obviously you're in a large group, which dilutes it somewhat, and it's short. If you're not usually into scare mazes, I wouldn't skip Sub-Terra, and I say that as a scaredy cat myself.